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"KRS/GT" Technical Q&A K1200RS/GT Technical Questions/Answers

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  #1  
Old 02-16-2016, 01:26 PM
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pbegin@burton pbegin@burton is offline
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K1200RS/GT Master cylinders cleaning and inspection

Ouf....Google+.Can't they just leave things alone so the infrequent users don't have to relearn.

Thread will be dismantling/inspection and reassembly of front MCs on the K1200RS/GT but will apply to most BMWs. But first let me show what showed up on fleabay a few months ago. Everything from above the forks top plate all the way up to the mirrors and all the way down to the throttle bodies.Mounts/bars...switches all there. All that for less than $100.00 US.Very much in demand, I didn't wait for the usual watchers beating me on that. I clicked on buy right away so they weren't on there for more that a few hours.


I don't need them MCs but I had a bad experience with an earlier BMW MC. Took it apart and noticed the dirt/beginnings of corrosion. I didn't have much time to clean/polish/grease it so tossed it on the shelf for a year or so. By the time I got to it everything was so corroded from the residual brake fluid attracting moisture that no amount of cleaning/polishing could have fixed it. Trashed.....

I don't want that to happen to them parts.....I may need them someday so my purpose here will be to clean/inspect and store properly. If ever needed I'll know for sure that I can just install as is.

Here we go....!

Remove the switch and the brake lever. Important note is that the pivot bolt for the lever is Loctited in there.

Work the bolt out back & forth with some lube to break and loosen the bond. Not doing so and the risk that the threads will come out is real from past experiences. With the pivot in hand.....remove all that Loctite and make sure the bolt can be screwed in by hand. You do not want to strip it reinstalling from the dried out Loctite. And it doesn't need Loctite on reinstallation....that's about 100,000 kms on my bike without Loctite, never came loose.....!





See the MC/lever adjustment screw? DO NOT REMOVE OR ADJUST!


Pull the boot out carefully and inspect for splits/cracks. That one is good but the one on the clutch MC had a split.

And the circlip is revealed...I am so glad that BMW finally switched to a SS circlip in the 90's. Earlier ones were steel and would corrode and the rust would eat at the plain Alu bore and pistons of them earlier MCs.




Above pic does show the OEM lube on the end of the piston.They must have a recommendation for a "special approved lube"..... Sure looks like Lubriplate/white grease so that's what I used on reassembly.

Circlip met my cheap circlip pliers. $5.00? But they have to be the long nose type to reach in there:





Remove the white grease and send the piston for a bath. Into the Methyl Hydrate it went. Cheap bath....no need for the expensive/bad for the health brake cleaners, Methyl Hydrate is the recommended product to clean brake parts. In both Clymer and the BMW shop manual.

Bore? I stuffed a Kleenex in there and moistened it with Methyl Hydrate. And then brushed the reservoir in the bath. A little blast of air to dry things out...time to inspect the bore. No marks....corrosion or residual dried out brake fluid/water mix. That's good!

Looks like the PO of that bike did change the fluid regularily.Kept things spiffy for 100,000 miles.

Reassuring to know....I am pretty anal about brake systems maintenance/fluid changes so my now >100,000 miles bike most probably doesn't have a compromised MC so good chance the spare will sit on the shelf for years.





Bore and piston greased with "Red rubber grease".Fully compatible(and dissolves) with brake fluid unlike them other products that I see recommended at times on this and other forums. DO NOT USE sillycone based products. They may look like they will mix with brake fluid at first. A couple days later and the sillycone product will congeal back into greasy clumps that may plug part of the braking system.

In case of doubt....and as per the manual(s) use brake fluid to lube the parts. But remove any residual brake fluid from the outside of the bore/piston, it may attract moisture and cause corrosion.

Not so critical here with them anodised BMW/Magura MCs but still a good precaution to take in case the anodizing/coatings are chipped. And that's why I prefer the "Red rubber grease", excess can just be spread around and will prevent corrosion. And good preservative for most BMW rubber so plenty of shop uses.



Darn circlip.....easy to remove but not always so to install. Circlip on the piston, push assembly down with a socket that fits just over the end of the piston. 7/16" in this case and the 6" extension. That gives you just enough room to insert the long nose circlip pliers and lock the circlip in place.Sorry no pics of that.....I only have two hands.



That one went in easy but further inspection showed that the circlip wasn't in all the way.Pushed it in with a bigger socket,5/8", and a little tap with the plastic hammer. Was easy to see that one of the inside tabs on the circlip wasn't fully contacting the piston.



Should look like this when done:





A little dab of Lubriplate on the end of the piston and then reinstall the boot. Of course I greased it with "Red rubber grease", the stuff is really good at preserving rubber bits.

Cover after a bath in Methyl Hydrate. See the corrosion? They are open to the atmosphere so moisture can and will build up between the diaphragm and cover. I hope you guys inspect that when you do your fluid changes.




A little Dremel work with the BRASS brush then another bath in Methyl, nice and clean.You can see the slots next to the screw holes where they vent the cover:



All greased up.....won't corrode again anytime soon.And of course I greased the diaphragm.Expensive for what they are most of them BMW rubber bits,might as well preserve them for the long run.



And the screws?.....before cleaning. Anyone familiar with the BMW bleed procedure will/should know about the warning. DO NOT let brake fluid down the threaded cover holes on the reservoir. Doing so will bring about corrosion and will also strip the coating from the SS screws.Yep them came out with white corrosion shit on them and peeled coating. Darn POs/mechanics......!



No problems.....off to the wire wheel with the screws,I prefer them shiny SS than cheap looking peeling black anyway.

Threads greased up....screws greased up,done with that corrosion.



All back together. Off to the spares bin/shelf it goes. And because I may never need it or if I do it may be in a few years I tagged it as to work done/inspection and potential issues. No issues on that tag....Clutch side may have a little issue but them pics will have to wait for another day.

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  #2  
Old 02-16-2016, 02:00 PM
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Re: K1200RS/GT Master cylinders cleaning and inspection

Quote:
Originally Posted by pbegin@burton
....
......
Thread will be dismantling/inspection and reassembly of front MCs on the K1200RS/GT but will apply to most BMWs.
....
......

Great tutorial - Thank you!!

I am sure this will help many owners of similar Magura Brake/Clutch master-cylinders. These were also used on many R1100xx and R1150xx boxer models.
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K1200RS (2002 IceBlue/Red - 95,000 miles)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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++++++++++++++++++++++++++
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Old 02-16-2016, 02:08 PM
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Re: K1200RS/GT Master cylinders cleaning and inspection

Thanks Pierre, I'm making this one a "Sticky" in the tech forum!
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Old 02-16-2016, 02:28 PM
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pbegin@burton pbegin@burton is offline
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Re: K1200RS/GT Master cylinders cleaning and inspection

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailor
Great tutorial - Thank you!!

I am sure this will help many owners of similar Magura Brake/Clutch master-cylinders. These were also used on many R1100xx and R1150xx boxer models.

I'll have more pics tomorrow of the clutch side. And maybe some questions on the L/H multifunction switch. One of the wires was cooked 1/2" long. The green/black one. I fixed that but cautious me won't test it on the bike until I am satisfied of my repair. I opened the switch....looked good in there but can't relate the green/black wire to anything in the diagrams and I couldn't see where that wire goes without pulling more than I wanted out of the switch. Watch the video? Push to pass doesn't work as per the seller and that is a from a 2002 with unfused headlight.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PW3jiSC6IOY

Thanks CJ....I won't clutter my brake thread with electrical stuff,the switch cleaning/inspection is probably worth its own thread if only to make the Hi/Lo switch smoother to operate.
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Benelli 50cc at 14
Yamaha RD200 at 16
Yamaha RD350 at 17
Honda CB750F at 18
Honda V45 Sabre at 24
85 BMW K100RS at 28 (Very nice and sorely missed)
90 BMW R100GS at 34 (Too slow, too cranky)
2003 K1200 RS at 53 (Oh Yeah......over 6000RPM)
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Old 02-16-2016, 06:13 PM
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Re: K1200RS/GT Master cylinders cleaning and inspection

"can't relate the green/black wire to"

looking at the BMW schematic for the left Kombi switch. The only thing close is a .75 mm dia. GNBL - - green/blue wire coming from the load reduction relay. Other wires show WS - -white and WSGE - - white/yellow. Hope this helps.
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Old 02-17-2016, 11:29 AM
pbegin@burton's Avatar
pbegin@burton pbegin@burton is offline
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Re: K1200RS/GT Master cylinders cleaning and inspection

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb
"can't relate the green/black wire to"

looking at the BMW schematic for the left Kombi switch. The only thing close is a .75 mm dia. GNBL - - green/blue wire coming from the load reduction relay. Other wires show WS - -white and WSGE - - white/yellow. Hope this helps.

I think I figured it out....and need new glasses. I was looking at the cooked part of the wire but with the magnifier it is a Green/blue from a 2002 CC equipped bike. Fused at 15A and goes to CC multifunction switch/CC clutch switch and CC system.And unusual for BMW there are no part numbers on the switch. But from the parts fiche....wouldn't fit my 03 so can't test in place while watching Jean's video.

Back to MCs....!
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Benelli 50cc at 14
Yamaha RD200 at 16
Yamaha RD350 at 17
Honda CB750F at 18
Honda V45 Sabre at 24
85 BMW K100RS at 28 (Very nice and sorely missed)
90 BMW R100GS at 34 (Too slow, too cranky)
2003 K1200 RS at 53 (Oh Yeah......over 6000RPM)
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Old 02-17-2016, 12:21 PM
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Re: K1200RS/GT Master cylinders cleaning and inspection

Quote:
Originally Posted by pbegin@burton
I think I figured it out....and need new glasses. I was looking at the cooked part of the wire but with the magnifier it is a Green/blue from a 2002 CC equipped bike. Fused at 15A and goes to CC multifunction switch/CC clutch switch and CC system.And unusual for BMW there are no part numbers on the switch. But from the parts fiche....wouldn't fit my 03 so can't test in place while watching Jean's video.

Back to MCs....!

Pierre,
For a LEFT combo switch on a 2001-2002 K1200RS having cruise-control like the used switch you bought:
1) you should have 2 connectors at end: 1 large RED flat 18 pins connector AND 1 smaller BLACK 6 pins connector. They both go into the relay-junction box to find matching color connectors.

2) On these years (2001-2002), you should have 2 wires with Green/Blue color: one of these goes toward small BLACK 6 pins connector (for cruise function) and the other goes into the large RED connector into pin 12 (this is for flashing high-beam).

On the later K1200RS and K1200GT (2003-2005) , there is NO small 6 pins Black connector as everything, including Cruise-control, is hooked into the large RED connector.
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K1200RS (2002 IceBlue/Red - 95,000 miles)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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http://www.i-bmw.com/classifieds/sho...500&ppuser=144
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
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  #8  
Old 02-17-2016, 12:56 PM
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pbegin@burton pbegin@burton is offline
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Re: K1200RS/GT Master cylinders cleaning and inspection

Part II....clutch side.

Clean sheet of paper and now that I know what tools/supplies I need I can line them up.



And send the bits for a soak as I clean the MC.Reservoir did look clean but the Methyl turned dark so yes there was some dried out stuff in there.







Don't know if my cheap camera will show? Right at the center of the seal,R/H on the pic there is a wear mark. It does look like a tiny piece of something got in there and marked the seal in a linear fashion. Didn't go as far as to the edge of the seal so I'd call it good enough for the low pressure clutch system.

For now I'd think that the wear lines up with the hole(s) in the reservoir and that someone may not have taken all the precautions required to refill them reservoirs and did let some grits in.

Or maybe a tiny burr left over from the manufacturing/anodizing process? I did look for that but didn't see anything and lucky for me (and the PO) the bore is intact, no wear marks on the anodized finish.

Or....if one looks closely at the pic, the spring has worn through the anodizing, you can see the shiny Alu.Maybe that was the source of the seal wear?

So whatever that was it is gone and that CLUTCH MC piston is going back in.I'd really think twice doing such on the high pressure brake side. Brake side would get a new pi$ton.



Tagged and ready to put on the shelf but I'll edit my tag on bore/piston shape.Will go from very good to....good with more notes.



And has per my note on the split boot....I should look at my vintage BMW parts there may be a good boot in there.

I guess the PO was a clutcher....the boot has 2 splits. No splits on my bike at the same mileage but I do remove the handles every couple years and pull the boots out, that lets me inspect the MCs for leaks and grease the boots for long term preservation.




And the aftermath.....I guess I did need a few more tools/supplies after all.But by then I had already checked the microswitches....fixed the burned wire on the multifunction switch and gotten rid of the split loom the PO had used as a quick fix for the broken casing. All retaped with old style looking BMW clolth tape aka "Made in Canada" hockey tape.



I'll update this when I do the yearly fluid change on my bike. Yes I do them too often! But at now 164,000 kms and 34,700 of that last year....never had a problem with my brakes that I couldn't fix and but for some issues when installing the Spieglers none of them problems had anything to do with the hydraulics MCs or calipers.
__________________
Benelli 50cc at 14
Yamaha RD200 at 16
Yamaha RD350 at 17
Honda CB750F at 18
Honda V45 Sabre at 24
85 BMW K100RS at 28 (Very nice and sorely missed)
90 BMW R100GS at 34 (Too slow, too cranky)
2003 K1200 RS at 53 (Oh Yeah......over 6000RPM)
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